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Post by Melanie on Jul 20, 2006 12:37:13 GMT
Bubalus murrensis
some sources say it became extinct in Pleistocene but other, e.g. the German Wikipedia state it became extinct in the antiquity (100 BC to 100 AD)
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Post by Carlos on Jul 20, 2006 18:30:31 GMT
First time I heard of this species.
Where was this species suposed to live in Europe two thousand years ago?
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Post by Melanie on Jul 20, 2006 18:43:56 GMT
Fossils were found in Germany and the Netherlands. Bubalus murrensis found for the first time in the Netherlands In 1997, the first specimen of Bubalus murrensis was reported from the Netherlands. A left horn core was dredged from a gravel pit at Netterden. The species is not only new for the Netherlands, the dutch specimen represents also the westernmost finding of the species. Geological circumstances and other findings from the same site point to a Middle or Late Pleistocene age, but the authors suppose this particular fossil stems from Eemian deposits. Dam, I. van; Mol, D.; Vos, J. de & Reumer, J.W.F., 1997: De eerste vondst van de Europese waterbuffel, Bubalus murrensis (Berckhemer, 1927) in Nederland. Cranium 14, 1: 49-54 hem.wtnord.net/bb95100253/palma/lit/bub_murr.htm |
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Post by Melanie on Jul 20, 2006 21:08:52 GMT
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Post by another specialist on Jul 20, 2006 21:32:33 GMT
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Post by Carlos on Jul 20, 2006 22:26:44 GMT
Thanks for the info.
I'm very curious. So, at least it has been recorded in Emian Interglacial deposits (that is about 120,000 BP).
Any serious Holocene record?
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Post by Melanie on Jul 20, 2006 22:30:01 GMT
Unfortunately not, Both the found from the Murr River in Germany (type locality from 1927) and the found from the Netherlands are from the Emian period (125,000 BP).
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Post by Carlos on Jul 20, 2006 22:54:17 GMT
I see. Thanks for your quick reply, Melanie.
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david
Full Member
Posts: 419
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Post by david on Jul 21, 2006 9:37:49 GMT
So is wiki wrong?
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Post by another specialist on Jul 21, 2006 9:55:33 GMT
Will generally all the information from wiki has come from the net somewhere. So we need to find the original source where this info originated from. |
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Post by another specialist on Jul 21, 2006 9:58:20 GMT
Bubalus murrensis some sources say it became extinct in Pleistocene but other, e.g. the German Wikipedia state it became extinct in the antiquity (100 BC to 100 AD) Have you got link for the above Melanie? |
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Post by Melanie on Jul 21, 2006 10:36:01 GMT
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Post by another specialist on Jul 21, 2006 10:49:56 GMT
Thanks for link Melanie Shame it seems not to show source/reference to info used? |
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Post by Melanie on Jul 21, 2006 11:32:20 GMT
Well i have written to Mr. Schreiber who has written the above mentionend PDF-paper. If he can confirm that wild water buffalos survived until the Holocene in Europe it will stay here. If it really became comepletely extinct in Pleistocene it will moved.
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Post by another specialist on Jul 22, 2006 6:29:49 GMT
Ok will wait for reply.
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david
Full Member
Posts: 419
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Post by david on Jul 26, 2006 20:40:32 GMT
I can't imagine it is right. It can't possibly be. Can it?
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Post by another specialist on Jul 26, 2006 20:46:25 GMT
I can't imagine it is right. It can't possibly be. Can it? Well we will have to wait to see if melanie gets an answer back hopefully soon. |
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Post by Bucardo on Jul 27, 2006 11:45:29 GMT
Probably a mistake. The name "buffalo" came from the Greek word "bubalos", used in Antiquity to name a wild form of ox (probably aurochs, or may be European bison). The only information that I have about water buffalos in Europe are ancient Pleistocene records and the animals introduced by the Ottomans in the Balkans around the 15th century.
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david
Full Member
Posts: 419
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Post by david on Jul 27, 2006 13:20:07 GMT
That seems more plausible to me Bucardo. Most of the members on the forum are from Europe and I would assume at least one of us would know of European Water Buffalo alive in the more modern times.
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Post by another specialist on Jul 27, 2006 15:47:03 GMT
There is no question that this species existed Bubalus murrensis but the question that is still open is it exact extinction date. If you look on page 1 of this thread you will see an image and it does resemble a buffalo not a bison or aurochs.
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